STP lost their Hard Rock Spark?

[Stpilots98]

That said I do have concerns about Scott (the person, not the musician) too.

I think most of us do.  It seems like they are all so distant even when getting interviewed together.    They need a Dean and Scott radio tour like they did during the NO.4 promotion.  It could be like a couples retreat

[Tyrant]

That said I do have concerns about Scott (the person, not the musician) too.

I think most of us do.  It seems like they are all so distant even when getting interviewed together.    They need a Dean and Scott radio tour like they did during the NO.4 promotion.  It could be like a couples retreat

Or ultimate break-up    

[cagedtiger1640]

Thanks for understanding.  This makes me happy that there are civil STP fans out there who can have a genuine discussion.  Unglued I'm all for evolviing music as well, which I feel STP has done on every album.  Also Stpilots98 your right I wouldnt consider SLDD a hard album either.  It does have a nice mix though of hard and soft songs.  Don't get me wrong I love both sides of STP.  The hard rocking and the softer side (absolutley love Atlanta and I got you).  I guess i'm having trouble adjusting to this in between kind of sound, but i got to give it to them it sure is different than anything they have ever done.  Also like stpilots98 said maybe this album will end up having some great hard rockers on it as well you never know.  I hope everyones optomistic views are correct.  I still have hope I guess I was just expecting more than what i've heard so far.  Maybe i'll end up loving the new album and maybe I won't.  Either way I still love STP.  As mentioned before I guess only time will tell.  Reguardless I really enjoy hearing everyones honest opinions of the new material.

[cagedtiger1640]

Also i forgot to mention I did kinda like nickelcraps first album too.  I had hopes for them beeing a decent band after hearing it.  Unfortunatley that didn't happen lol.

[Pingfah]

I would agree that these tracks don't exactly show off that side of STP, and I do really like them but they haven't grabbed me like some of the older stuff.

But then I do remember that none of STPs albums have immediately grabbed me as the best thing ever on the first few listens, but all 5 are now amongst my fave albums. If I had to list a top 10 albums of all time, at least 4 of them would be STP records.

Tiny Music particularly is a drastic departure from Purple, and I would not really say it has that hard rock edge either, although I do think it is the greatest rock album of all time, after A Night at The Opera of course.

[disasterami]

so what is a worthy topic?  I was expressing my opinion and said I am still going to give it a chance.  I just wanted to see what others opinions were.   Why can't we be civil and discuss without insulting?

I like topics like this because it gives different perspective then the typical idea that every songs STP does is amazing simply because STP wrote it.  I personally like all of the new songs except for Bagman, but I can understand where you are coming from.  Scott's vocals *especially live* lately really turn me off, but I can't really agree on the melodies *hickory's melody is fantastic!*
As far as no really good rockers on the album as of yet, I say be patient.  I highly doubt out of the 12 songs there won't be a couple balls out rock songs.  I think Fast as I can sounded like a good rocker from the clip.  Also I wouldn't consider Shangri-La a hard album sans Coma and Dumb love.

Haha yes Nickelback takes the cake for sure.  Hmm I guess the cheesyness I see so far is the following: (obviously others might disagree and thats fine).

Speaking of Nickelcrap, does anyone like their first cd or am I the only one?  I actually thought they were going to be a good band when that one came out.  I guess not

Felt the first album was very Bleach (Nirvana), not strong on vocal lines, just goin by wat Cobain used to do, but atleast Nirvana kept improving and raising the bar up to the eventual In Utero! and Nickelcrap's so oh my god cheesed up these days!

[VeiledTrickerySTP]

Core was probably their hardest rock album yet also their weakest quality in my opinion. While I think Core is still awesome, it's the rest of STP's work, whether it be as a group or in their other projects, that hooked me in more. If Scott still had his Core sounding voice and never deviated from that, I don't think many people would be fans of his.

Listen to Happy in Galoshes. Not a hard rock song to be found but it's a solid album.

[cagedtiger1640]

I guess hard rock was the wrong way to word it.   I'll just change it to have they lost their edge.   And by the way Core is also my least favorite STP album even though I still think its really good, and I am so glad Scott has changed over the years giving us a very diverse collection of STP.  My favorite version was the Tiny version but i love all of them so far. I agree tiny was a vast departure from purple and it is my favorite STP album and probably in my top 5 favorite albums of all time.  However I do feel that Tiny had more of a rocknroll edgy sound than any of these new song do in my opinion.  I guess these songs rock too they just sound "slicker" or something.  The past records sounded rawer vocally.  I can't quite describe my feelings accuratley.  To me it just feels like some kind of edge/attitude is missing.

By the way I did not enjoy happy very much I just thought it was ok.  To Poppy for me, I am a much bigger fan of 12 bar blues as far as Scott solo goes.  Now that I'm thinking about it maybe i'm just not feeling the direction Scott has been heading musically and that could have a lot to do with my feelings about these three songs.  I still hope some how the album ends up making me eat my words and it absolutley blows my mind.

[Stop That Pigeon]

These songs sound poppy/cheesy to me.  I think it is mostly do to scott.  HIs lyrics and melodies on these three songs have been very cheesy in my opinion.  It leaves me wondering where did the hard rocking STP machine with attitude and swagger go?  I hope the album proves me wrong as these are only three songs but I’m beginning to worry that STP is going to actually put out a mediocre album.  I did not think this was possible.   I personally think Scott has totally lost his drive and edge he had in his more youthful days.  Every time you see him anymore he either looks pissed off, or depressed.  Its like he lost his personality.  Remember his energy and personality in the NO.4 days.  He even had good energy during the SLDD tour.  What happened? I do not know but i feel that unfortunately it has made the music suffer.  

They are poppy but, for me, not cheesy - I've always loved that side of STP.

I think the melodies lack a bit of creativity - I would like to hear Scott weaving his way in between the riffs/licks the way he used to. That's what created much of the power & tension imo - it's not all about "heaviness" as such.

I'm not sure how much Scott has "lost" - I thought Libertad was going to be average from him but "American Man" & "Gravedancer" are up there with his best work I think. Also, when I saw STP on the SLDD tour, Scott was 75% at best whereas with VR in '07 he was fantastic (and I was sober both times btw   ) so it's hard to be definitive about his capabilities these days.

Thanks for the post - this is a very valid thread and a number of great points have been made.

[Sunday Shoes]

This is STP's charm.

They are a band that is always on the move, and they are not afraid to put anything out there that may rock the boat.  

Every song will not be a hit, but there are some real gems in every single one of their albums.

[Pingfah]

I guess hard rock was the wrong way to word it.  I'll just change it to have they lost their edge.  I agree tiny was a vast departure for purple and it is my favorite STP album and probably in my top 5 favorite albums of all time.  However I do feel that Tiny had more of a rocknroll edgy sound than any of these new song do in my opinion.  I guess these songs rock too they just sound "slicker" or something.  I can't quite describe my feelings accuratley.  I think maybe I just don't hear the pure emotion beeing poured into these songs like it was on past records like tiny music.  I understand that that statement is really subjective, but its the only way i can think to describe what I am trying to say.

I understand what you mean, there's a spark in STP stuff, something almost undefineable but that elevates them above other rock bands, a special chemistry, which is why you are having trouble expressing what you mean.

I agree, it's not quite there, but there's another 9 tracks to come yet, in the context of the album these tracks we have heard so far might just slot right in. They've never let us down yet, so I am thinking things will probably be fine.

[DumbLove]

Ok before everyone starts flaming me.  I have been a huge STP fan from the start.  Bought all the albums the day they came out and have seen them live about 7 times.  My favorite album is probably Tiny Music and my least favorite album is Core.  I had very high hopes for this album, but after hearing these three songs I'm beginning to get worried.  These songs sound poppy/cheesy to me.  I think it is mostly do to scott.  HIs lyrics and melodies on these three songs have been very cheesy in my opinion.  It leaves me wondering where did the hard rocking STP machine with attitude and swagger go?  I hope the album proves me wrong as these are only three songs but I’m beginning to worry that STP is going to actually put out a mediocre album.  I did not think this was possible.   I personally think Scott has totally lost his drive and edge he had in his more youthful days.  Every time you see him anymore he either looks pissed off, or depressed.  Its like he lost his personality.  Remember his energy and personality in the NO.4 days.  He even had good energy during the SLDD tour.  What happened? I do not know but i feel that unfortunately it has made the music suffer.  If you like this brand of STP more power to you, but I for one am a little worried that they lost their rock spark.  Ya this album will be better than most anything out there right now because these guys are extremely talented, but let’s be honest do these 3 songs really live up to STP standards?  In my opinion they do not.  You’re not going to hear these songs on classic rock radio ten years from now like you will hear "ILS" "Vasoline" "plush" Trippin" "Sex Type Thing" "Big Bang Baby" etc.....
As I said this is just my initial opinion after hearing these three songs.  I will give the album a fair chance.  Like i said I am a huge STP fan and do believe that Scott was won of the best front men ever.  So I’m not trying to bash the boys.  This is just my opinion based on the three songs I have heard so far.  I am not trying to start a war with the STP fans who feel they can do no wrong no matter what (because i know they exist).  That is definitely not my internet, but respectful opinions are welcome.

I believe that everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but I'm not sure what you mean by "rocking edge."  You said Core was your least favorite album, but by most standards it is their most hard rocking.  Secondly, when you mention their hits that you would hear on the radio ten years from now, I don't think any of those are from their last two albums.  And more important, a radio hit does not necessarily equate to a good song.  It sounds like you have an issue with Scott's attitude more than the music, which are two separate entities.

Tiny Music is my favorite album as well, but I feel this album will be their best since TM by far based on what we've heard thus far.  I've loved everything I've heard, and you're talking to someone who thought No.4 and SLDD were only good not great, so I'm definitely not one who thinks STP can do no wrong.  Then again, I'm a fan of this bluesier route they're taking and love this Tiny Music meets Libertad vibe they have going.  And can you really say these lyrics are cheesier than anything in "Days Of The Week" or "Sour Girl"?

Having said all that, I hope you don't take this as an attack.  If you don't like the new material, by all means, please continue to voice your opinion as it does facilitate good discussion.  If anyone starts flaming you for doing so, they're just douches plain and simple.

[cagedtiger1640]

So many of you have made such valid points and I honeslty can see where everyone is coming from.  I want to respond to a few of you that really caught my attention.  First reguarding the edge or rock I was talking about.  I really poorly described what I was trying to say.  Fortunatley other board members helped me out and almost perfectly described what I was trying to say when I said STP lost their "edge".   Board Member Stop that Pigeon wrote: "I think the melodies lack a bit of creativity - I would like to hear Scott weaving his way in between the riffs/licks the way he used to. That's what created much of the power & tension imo - it's not all about "heaviness" as such".

I understand what you mean, there's a spark in STP stuff, something almost undefineable but that elevates them above other rock bands, a special chemistry, which is why you are having trouble expressing what you mean.

I agree, it's not quite there, but there's another 9 tracks to come yet, in the context of the album these tracks we have heard so far might just slot right in. They've never let us down yet, so I am thinking things will probably be fine.

This is what I was trying to get it.  Ironically enough they described what I was trying to say almost perfectly.  Thanks guys/gals!

[Stpilots98]

I'm not sure how much Scott has "lost" - I thought Libertad was going to be average from him but "American Man" & "Gravedancer" are up there with his best work I think. Also, when I saw STP on the SLDD tour, Scott was 75% at best whereas with VR in '07 he was fantastic (and I was sober both times btw   ) so it's hard to be definitive about his capabilities these days..

That's interesting because American Man is my least favorite song Scott has ever been involved in, I just hated his vocal work and thought the song was beyond cheesy.  His vocal work on Contraband was amazing and one of his best but he really disappointing me on Libertad.

Hey, that's what makes Weiland so great though he can change up his vocals so much I just for one wasn't a fan of Libertad or Happy in terms of his vocals.

[Wingless Bird]

I don't think that Scott has lost any of his vocal abilities.  I think it is just that he gets board of doing the same vocals time and time again. I don't think that by hearing 3 songs we can come to any conclusions, just listen to all the different styles on Happy. I just hope that there is at least one ballad on this album... although i really doubt it.