A letter from Mary.

[STPGurl]

There is only one thing I want to add to this discussion, but unfortunately I honestly can't come up with the evidence or even the correct timeframe. When I read her letter, it reminded me of something Mary (or her sister Julie) either posted here on BE or on the old VR forum. I don't remember when or where. Could even have been that she sent it to me by e-mail, but I can't find any evidence in my e-mail archives either. I just know it was a couple of years ago, most likely after VR disbanded.

The gist of it was that she posted a plea to stop supporting what Scott was doing at the time, because he was putting himself in a bad environment (or was being exploited by others, or a combination of both) and it would ruin him. She knew then what she wrote and published now. His decline was her worst nightmare come true. She saw it coming, posted a plea at the time and witnessed it come true over the last couple of years with the tragic last chapter a week ago.

I vaguely remember what you are talking about (the post) and I want to say it was the VR forum.

I agree 10000000% to the highlighted.

[Aylin]

He was a good man, a talented musician and the love of my life.
We had our ups and downs and unfortunately the downs got more and more frequent until I had to think of the wellbeing of my children more than my marriage to him.
He was a sick man and couldn't get back on the healthy path. The last 10 years of touring and putting himself in less than healthy working environments added to this downward spiral.
The lifestly that he represented was exciting and rock n roll, but I'm here to say that we as a society shouldn't glorify the excesses that this talent brings. There are some that can balance the good and the bad, and there are others, like Scott, who couldn't. From an intelligent, cultured, loving, talented man and father to our children, he became a lost and tired shell of his old self. I lost the true Scott many years ago, but having him gone forever is a grief that our children and I will have to come to terms with. Don't buy the tshirt blah blah....
ETC ETC ETC....

This is just an example of the things she could have said (obviously much more eloquently than me) that could have made us cry, mourn his demise long ago, sympathise with Mary, and not buy the tshirt.

[Pingfah]

You haven't upset me, merely baffled me with your absurd ideas.

 Absurd? It’s in his book.  I don’t even think that Mary graduated High School yet she was young & other than being a Rock Star Wife, she was a part-time model.  Do U think that after living such the life she had  she would settle for working at the Beverly Center in Beverly Hills or something…no, she took the VR money cuz the STP money went to his first wife…It’s not absurd; it’s a Woman’s point of view and it’s in his book.
I think it is in her book also when she got tired of trying to get him to stop so she then was basically, “Oh f it” & joined him…so who gave up first?  Who led who there?
Her “letter” in Rolling Stone was no doubt a huge pile of negativity…I feel sorry that she dragged the kids in it.  It’s all horrible & it’s how I feel.
On the side of Mary.  I can understand, although she really should have kept that to herself.  PPL do glorify Scott & in essence that unless you have really been backstage…it’s not pretty.  I wasn’t at their level but I was on my way, but things got in the way and my path changed.  I have been that person “in charge” of someone like Scott & one night can be exhausting trying to deal w/ that.  That’s what I think she was trying to convey.  Don’t make him like a God for lack of better word because he was the guy you were always having to take care of cuz he went beyond.  It sucks not matter what but she shouldn’t have said that to a major magazine…She’s Sour Girl now
The rollercoaster ride's a lonely one
 I pay the ransom note to stop it from steaming
 Hey, what are you looking at?
 She was a teenage girl when she met me
 
 
 

I'm sorry but most of this has nothing to do with what we were discussing.

You said she was trying to talk people out of buying his music because she doesn't get any money from it. I simply pointed out that this is silly, because people not buying Scott's music does not benefit her financially at all.

Additionally, Scott has property, a recording studio, and a shit-ton of publishing rights, you have no idea what is happening to any of that, so your negative assumptions about her motives are just that, assumptions and nothing more. We literally have no fucking idea what we are talking about. None of us.

[Aylin]

We literally have no fucking idea what we are talking about. None of us.

You're right about that. We don't know what we're talking about, apart from the way it makes us feel, and I feel really shitty when shitty things are said about a dead man when he can't defend himself.

[kilter]

I don't think we need to be attacking each other over this. We'll never know "the real truth" and what everyone's motivations are. Reading Mary's letter made me sad. I also think it was irresponsible of her to put that out there right after his death, but it doesn't sound scheming to me... more like impulsive words from someone in pain, angry, maybe lashing out at the world/situation, trying to get her feelings out and trying to turn this awfulness into something positive ("take a kid to a ballgame"). I don't know if she went about things in the best way. She does sound bitter and angry and hurt, but wouldn't you?

It's a sad situation with no possible happy resolution. It just sucks. We can all agree on that.

[Aaron]

There is only one thing I want to add to this discussion, but unfortunately I honestly can't come up with the evidence or even the correct timeframe. When I read her letter, it reminded me of something Mary (or her sister Julie) either posted here on BE or on the old VR forum. I don't remember when or where. Could even have been that she sent it to me by e-mail, but I can't find any evidence in my e-mail archives either. I just know it was a couple of years ago, most likely after VR disbanded.

The gist of it was that she posted a plea to stop supporting what Scott was doing at the time, because he was putting himself in a bad environment (or was being exploited by others, or a combination of both) and it would ruin him. She knew then what she wrote and published now. His decline was her worst nightmare come true. She saw it coming, posted a plea at the time and witnessed it come true over the last couple of years with the tragic last chapter a week ago.

I vaguely remember what you are talking about (the post) and I want to say it was the VR forum.

I agree 10000000% to the highlighted.

I remember this as well.  I am fairly sure (but not positive) it was Julie. 

As for all of us here, we're losing sight of what is important.  Nothing we say or do is going to bring Scott back.  It is a tragedy, but he is lost.  What we can do is focus our energy less on semantics of what is or isnt appropriate after a loved one dies and instead remember all the wonderful times and beautiful creations he gave us.  Scott was no doubt flawed, but its not our place to judge him (or Mary for that matter).  Instead, love the music he gave us.  We got 6 STP albums, 2 VR albums, 2 solo albums, a Wildabouts album, a Art of Anarchy album, a number of compilations, and a whole host of extra songs out of his illustrious career.  Yes, we would have all loved even more, but we should be thankful for what we have received... this amount of music is a whole hell of a lot more than most musicians put out in their careers.  We are truly blessed as fans.

It is a hard thing when someone you care about dies, but it is much better to celebrate the life than dwell onthe death. 

[Eighth Caged Tiger]

I honestly don't buy the "Scott had to keep touring just to pay alimony and bills."  He seemed to have no interest in changing things up and trying something like Chris Cornell - intimate shows in larger clubs that can be better monetized rather than random state fair and casino gigs with increasingly diminishing returns.  I think the truth is that Scott didn't want to change his schedule or his lifestyle.  It's the bubble he had permanently encased himself in - taking time off meant having time to look in the mirror and face reality, and the endless gigging was an escape from having to do that.  A fix is never far away on the road, be it pills, coke, you name it.

I think the real Scott died several years ago - the last bit of him likely right before Doug finally had to part ways with him.  It's tragic that a man so haunted by his own abandonment appears to have done the same to his own children, but honestly that's pretty common - when you go down the road Scott did, you become the thing you hate the most, and you repeat the exact same destructive behavior that was done to you.

I have no qualms with Mary's letter - it's incredibly poignant, and I don't think she shares anything we didn't already know if we're being honest with ourselves.  As for the guy blasting her that she wasn't allowing Scott to see the kids, can you really blame her?  Watch the video from April - would *you* let him see your kids? Speaking as the parent of three young kids, I wouldn't.  Sadly, it was likely better for the kids not to see him at all than to see him in the state he has likely spent most of the last decade in.

Scott probably had more influence on me and was more important to me than any other artist I've followed in my life, and I've been mourning his loss and listening to his music for the better part of a week now, but the fact is, as brilliant as he was, and as much as he meant to us, we knew he was in complete denial, and we didn't really want to know how bad things had gotten - we had a feeling they were really bad after first the band and then Doug had to abandon him, but we wanted to fool ourselves into thinking he would get better, or was at least doing better than he looked, when we knew that our worst suspicions were likely true.

[Sklashboombash]

I honestly don't buy the "Scott had to keep touring just to pay alimony and bills."  He seemed to have no interest in changing things up and trying something like Chris Cornell - intimate shows in larger clubs that can be better monetized rather than random state fair and casino gigs with increasingly diminishing returns.  I think the truth is that Scott didn't want to change his schedule or his lifestyle.  It's the bubble he had permanently encased himself in - taking time off meant having time to look in the mirror and face reality, and the endless gigging was an escape from having to do that.  A fix is never far away on the road, be it pills, coke, you name it.

I'll disagree here. I think his plea to reform VR and/or STP is all the argument you need to prove that he didn't like these shows with diminishing attendance.

If he was able to sustain his lifestyle by simply recording and playing sporadically large, well-paying shows, then he would have absolutely signed up for it.

Everything else you said, denial and such, is right on, but if Scott was able to do what Cornell is doing at the success that he's doing it, I think he would.

Problem is the lackluster performances and repetition of hitting the same markets began the decline of attendance and therefore money.

[Fear 2 Stop]

Question to those so horrifically appalled at Mary's letter: Are you a parent? Do you have children of your own or do you act as a parent to your significant others child/ren?

Not trying to shit-stir or claim superiority due to the fact that I have reproduced. Just genuinely curious if this is where the divide lies.

Yes...I have an 8 year old daughter. I also had a mother I didn't know because of her alcoholism.

[CritterTypeThing]

I honestly don't buy the "Scott had to keep touring just to pay alimony and bills."  He seemed to have no interest in changing things up and trying something like Chris Cornell - intimate shows in larger clubs that can be better monetized rather than random state fair and casino gigs with increasingly diminishing returns.  I think the truth is that Scott didn't want to change his schedule or his lifestyle.  It's the bubble he had permanently encased himself in - taking time off meant having time to look in the mirror and face reality, and the endless gigging was an escape from having to do that.  A fix is never far away on the road, be it pills, coke, you name it.

I'll disagree here. I think his plea to reform VR and/or STP is all the argument you need to prove that he didn't like these shows with diminishing attendance.

If he was able to sustain his lifestyle by simply recording and playing sporadically large, well-paying shows, then he would have absolutely signed up for it.

Everything else you said, denial and such, is right on, but if Scott was able to do what Cornell is doing at the success that he's doing it, I think he would.

Problem is the lackluster performances and repetition of hitting the same markets began the decline of attendance and therefore money.

Cornell, too, I feel makes a good game plan of spacing out his tours as well as hitting different markets.  Even with a decent amount of Scott's performances getting positive (not fantastic or like the days of old, but positive in general) reviews, he was still coming around very regularly, which you're just not going to get excessive returning customers outside of larger cities.

Top that off with the fact that Scott was running around branding The Wildabouts.  Not Scott solo.  While many of us appreciate Blaster, it just wasn't a huge success.  Anyone who may have bought tickets the first time The Wildabouts came to town, probably weren't coming back a second time when they realized there wasn't more than 2 or maybe 3 songs recognizing Scott's other ventures. 

Cornell is out there acknowledging and celebrating each facet of his career, and still has the voice and ability to go out solo acoustic.  I imagine he's probably making a good profit on such touring.  As much as I would have loved to have seen it when he was better suited, I don't think Scott could've gotten away with such a setup.

Scott was stuck in neutral.  I'm sure part of him wanted to make change.  I'm sure part of him didn't want to.  I'm sure part of him couldn't, regardless of his intention.

[Lazy Divey]

There is only one thing I want to add to this discussion, but unfortunately I honestly can't come up with the evidence or even the correct timeframe. When I read her letter, it reminded me of something Mary (or her sister Julie) either posted here on BE or on the old VR forum. I don't remember when or where. Could even have been that she sent it to me by e-mail, but I can't find any evidence in my e-mail archives either. I just know it was a couple of years ago, most likely after VR disbanded.

The gist of it was that she posted a plea to stop supporting what Scott was doing at the time, because he was putting himself in a bad environment (or was being exploited by others, or a combination of both) and it would ruin him. She knew then what she wrote and published now. His decline was her worst nightmare come true. She saw it coming, posted a plea at the time and witnessed it come true over the last couple of years with the tragic last chapter a week ago.

I vaguely remember that too.  I know Mary used to lurk on these or the VR boards years ago

[qc]

(First time posting here, I've been lurking for years.)

Just decided to post because I'm reading people saying "oh, how come she isn't bipolar anymore?" "feels like a lie after the book", etc.


Honestly I never bothered w/her book, but I've been diagnosed bipolar 9 years ago. And this year, after MRI my neurologist just said I was misdiagnosed. "Oh, you have epilepsy, it's not the kind of seizures. Don't worry. At least you didn't lost much time of your life as bipolar and..."(this was before I told everything about my bipolar history)
I cried so much for days, because I didn't know if I was relieved or damn right confused, it gets to a point that you're the disease, the stigma, the insecurity of all coming back.

I know you guys probably don't want to read about a stranger, but it seems that any time bipolar subject came around this board when talking about Scott you guys were unsure about what it was like. In a way I'm glad most of you don't get it, 'cause at least it means you never been through it or witness someone really close to you being through this.

For me it all started with depression then stupor depression, to simplify and hurt less as I type, basically I was in bed waiting to die, doing literally nothing, not taking care of any needs, starving. After I got out of it with help of relatives and could walk again, I started doing therapy and I was sent to a neurologist by my shrink so I could be prescribed antidepressants. Not many improvement was seen and another doctor changed my medication and I started hallucinating and fell in psychosis. It all ended up with be committed to a mental institution in a straitjacket, being tied to my bed and being sedated. I spent a couple of months there. They diluted some medication so we wouldn't spit pills, it tasted terribly and I threw up and was then injected w/medication and started shaking and feeling really bad, almost overdosing until they gave me some antidote.


Anyways after this time in the m.institution I got diagnosed as bipolar by the doctor working there. I had a medication regime of many pills a day(at least 3 different medication mixed, one for mania/psychosis, one for dealing w/its side effects and another one for the side effects of the second one!). And this was the reason I always hoped Scott was saying the truth about being out illicit drugs, because any time I was going out of a manic episode and was being heavily medicated I'd be reduced to a zombie state, w/zero productivity, walking like an empty shell and even drooling. So I thought it could be side effects of his medication.(He mentioned takings med in Brett's interview and having trouble w/them)


And then after my medication was set to the minimum possible and I was again regaining my life, my thoughts, my sanity my psychiatrist(the same from the m. institution) would think it was not enough, that I was too slow, not lively as I should and would include an antidepressant. And anytime she did that, mania was back again. She kept adjusting the dose until I was a maniac again and trying different antidepressants. Never mind that anytime she's done that, all my progress, my life that was almost getting back to the tracks would be throw away in the most humiliating ways. And then heavy medication all again to end mania and then reduce it, then antidepressants. This cycle for 4 years.


Never mind that my life was ruined, that I was too embarrassed to want to see friends and even family again, after all I had done. I just want people to forget about me, the mess I was, I distanced myself from most people I could(and to this day I'm still quite distant of lot of people that still matter to me, cause I don't want to explain myself or make them feel sorry for me). But how come my doctor wanted me to look more livid if time after time I was accumulating misery, sadness...I had no proud or sense of dignity anymore. So I quit her.


I still had a medication regime w/another doctor, but then I decided to quit medication. After all that, it's only natural that would give up them. (Before I took all without questioning and where did it lead me?) Mania again. I found yet another doctor and this one changed my medication and although it was many pills at the start, as I was yet again regaining my sanity, he said to me that it was obvious I couldn't take antidepressants, that I was experiencing side effects that affected the minority of users. This was five years ago. I haven't had any mania episodes ever since.

I can say my life is for 5 years as stable as shitty lives can be. I mean, I'm thankful mania is gone but I still feel depressed and I suspect I may have some PSTD after the m. institution experience, I didn't get into detail here, but the things I've seen there...I was 16 at the time and as a minor my mother was able to be there w/me. To this day she says that that place is the closest thing to hell she can think about. And the times my life was starting again and being thrown to the ground, all progress lost...it really, it really hurts, it's like carrying an invisible burden of shame. I'm 100% sure if I was talking face to face w/you guys, I wouldn't say any of what I said here, it hurts so much, I think most of people don't want their own vulnerabilities exposed, especially the ones that will make you cry in front of strangers.

This year my neurologist, after I said what I said to you here and gave her my MRI exams, was like "oh no, this is really bad, really, really bad. You lost so much of your life" She wanted to know the name of the psychiatrist that prescribed the medication I still take everyday in minimum dose, 'cause she thinks he hit the nail perhaps by accident and by trying this medication that is primarily for epilepsy, secondly for schizophrenia and just more recently for bipolar disorder. So basically he tried something that was less usual for bipolar and it worked.

She said to me to never ever take antidepressants again, well I never would take those again even if I'm paid to anyway and to not even bother w/a psychiatrist anymore. "You don't need it" , she said. The thing is, I never had mania in my life before taking my second antidepressant.

I don't blame the doctor that messed up for 4 years w/me 'cause I know that the data was not there. In almost a decade lot of research was done and I've been following anything related ever since being diagnosed as bipolar years ago. The prescribing information of those medications have changed. All in all, it feels like I was a lab rat, but unfortunately I wasn't in a safe controlled environment.

So please, don't think that Mary saying she was misdiagnosed as bipolar is weird or that she's a liar. If you talked to me 6 months ago I'd say to you I was bipolar, hell, I could even write a whole book talking about what I've been through as a bipolar person and then find out I was not. I sought for a neurologist because of intense headaches, I wasn't expecting her to say that all my bipolar experience was medication induced and that I wasn't bipolar. And honestly, I don't know how the bipolar "tag" being removed makes things better after so much damaged was done. But perhaps I will start to believe more in myself and not think that I have a programmed sanity switch in the back of my mind that could turn anytime and ruin all I've built.



I was really heartbroken about what happened to Scott. I had no idea about it, then I turn on my phone and a friend messaged me. "Did Scott kill himself?" I was like in my head, "What? No, it can't be, it's a hoax, no...but if he's dead...I'll not cry, I'll be okay." Notifications about it and the news..."Okay, I'm okay. I won't cry." Then comes my mother to talk casually and I said to her, "Scott has died" "What, I can't hear it..." "Scott has died" "But how? What happened? Isn't it a hoax?" Then I just broke down crying, I could finish any sentences, I didn't want to read anymore, see anyone or answer my friend, I was angry w/her too, the worst way I could find out about his death, but how could she know I hadn't read the news anyway?

I only got to see STP once and it was the first gig I had the guts to join the crowd after my last mania episode. I was so damn nervous, insecure about going and the distress being in a crowd could cause me, but ultimately it was an amazing show and nothing bad happened. In a few days it'll be 5 years since that gig. 12/11/2010

Not my videos but I was there and almost 5 years ago I would never ever imagine we all would be grieving Scott so soon.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oyItWBcp7wQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhjUDn2QLt0

It was a small venue, but it's one that really has a big history over here. We were worried it wouldn't sold out, how could it not especially being the first time STP was in the city(after all if it don't sell no chance of coming back), but a week before it was sold out. To this day, I've never seem so many people trying to convince us in line for the gig to sell our tickets to them, people literally begging for tickets. It was no surprise that the next year STP was invited to play in a big festival in my country, but I couldn't travel to the city. Now, we could only guess what could've been of STP reunion. But this is what matters the last.


I did feel an accusing tone from Mary, kinda like Richard Patrick, pointing fingers to us, fans. But then again, what could we do? I used to tweet to Scott, but honestly I don't think he ever read those. Back in the Corpus Christi Vasoline Incident, I tweeted a long message(thanks to twitlonger) to support him, to say I knew how being bipolar was(before my new diagnose) but mostly to say music and even fans are important but fuck us, what matters is you, your family, being around those you love the most, don't give up. My opening line was begging to whoever run that account to forward to him, if ever reach him or not who knows. Would it make a difference? I don't know, but I feel guilty free of what Mary said.

About him being absent I feel for the kids 'cause I haven't seen my father in 21 years, he's married had kids but never bothered even telling me about them, found out thru my uncle, but my father and me is a completely different scenario and he lives in a different country. But he doesn't call or write.

Re-reading what I wrote about my "then bipolar" condition, kinda makes me feel that Scott may have distanced himself for similar reasons. Shame, guilty, you know, when you don't want to face someone's eyes even when you miss that person a lot? I never been addicted to anything, I can only imagine how his addiction made everything even worse and that the addiction in itself was caused by being bipolar. Destructive and even suicidal thoughts are really hard to overcome, worse yet, some medications even induce and increase these thoughts.


About the whole 60k thing, don't they adjust the payments if the person is making less? I don't get it.

So that his death isn't treated like many rock star deaths, with the same old tortured artist, soul too pure for this world narrative.

I agree completely, I think this is literally what I most read being said about Kurt by fans. And also the thing about sex, drugs & rock n' roll. Scott himself was too fascinated w/it, the insistence in "comparing" him to Bowie or Jagger, not everyone can endure the same things. And it isn't just him, it's worse, how many wannabe rock stars in the world get trapped within this mentality and die young before we could even know about them? I was once at a concert of a young band that is getting buzz here and even overseas and a girl in the audience, "boo! Look at that! they're drinking water! Water! Fuck you! If it was Eddie Vedder he'd be drinking at least wine! Fucking piece of shit!" I guess to her he's a fool just for trying to preserve his voice for the years to come.


 
And sorry for writing so many lines, but I felt as I had to. To think shame affected me and still affects me so much, imagine for Scott being in the public eye. These last years have been terrible for him and this year things got really bad. It's so debilitating and devastating, how many times have I cried because I could feel my spirit was dying? It's the feeling of nothingness, of being nothing, having nothing to give to anyone and that you can't fix anything anymore. That all is lost and there's no hope left.

[Westenn]

You haven't upset me, merely baffled me with your absurd ideas.

 Absurd? It’s in his book.  I don’t even think that Mary graduated High School yet she was young & other than being a Rock Star Wife, she was a part-time model.  Do U think that after living such the life she had  she would settle for working at the Beverly Center in Beverly Hills or something…no, she took the VR money cuz the STP money went to his first wife…It’s not absurd; it’s a Woman’s point of view and it’s in his book.
I think it is in her book also when she got tired of trying to get him to stop so she then was basically, “Oh f it” & joined him…so who gave up first?  Who led who there?
Her “letter” in Rolling Stone was no doubt a huge pile of negativity…I feel sorry that she dragged the kids in it.  It’s all horrible & it’s how I feel.
On the side of Mary.  I can understand, although she really should have kept that to herself.  PPL do glorify Scott & in essence that unless you have really been backstage…it’s not pretty.  I wasn’t at their level but I was on my way, but things got in the way and my path changed.  I have been that person “in charge” of someone like Scott & one night can be exhausting trying to deal w/ that.  That’s what I think she was trying to convey.  Don’t make him like a God for lack of better word because he was the guy you were always having to take care of cuz he went beyond.  It sucks not matter what but she shouldn’t have said that to a major magazine…She’s Sour Girl now
The rollercoaster ride's a lonely one
 I pay the ransom note to stop it from steaming
 Hey, what are you looking at?
 She was a teenage girl when she met me
 
 
 

I'm sorry but most of this has nothing to do with what we were discussing.

You said she was trying to talk people out of buying his music because she doesn't get any money from it. I simply pointed out that this is silly, because people not buying Scott's music does not benefit her financially at all.

Additionally, Scott has property, a recording studio, and a shit-ton of publishing rights, you have no idea what is happening to any of that, so your negative assumptions about her motives are just that, assumptions and nothing more. We literally have no fucking idea what we are talking about. None of us.

Nobody knows what their talking about.  It's called grieving.  I have yet to read anything that makes sense & that's including my own stuff.  Let it go & let ppl get out what they need to get out.  It doesn't matter if it makes sense or not.  We need answers.  We need to know what we could have done to stop this.  I can go on and on.

I wish I could answer better my thoughts but I'm going to stop it here.  I'm not here to make sure Mary overshadows Scott.  I'm here to grieve his loss.  I read Mary's letter & my thoughts & feelings went this way period.  It's not negative assumptions.  It's reality.  I'm done.

I totally get.  I may be part of the STP community, but I'm certainly not part of this side-bar community.  U need someone to blame, to put your anger on & it's easier to put it on a stranger who doesn't belong in your circle.  I'm not that girl. 

I have listened to STP since 1993 & I feel the same frustrations as Mary, Robert, Eric & Dean towards Scott.  I remember I was sitting on my roommate's blue velvet couch when Kurt Loder goes on & said Scott got arrested for drugs.  I can't remember tho' if that was before or after Cobain's death.  From that moment on, that was all you heard on the news forever so that makes it 1994-95ish. For 20 years, every time I heard news about Scott & his problems, it's instant you want to punch him in the face & say, "wtf dude, get it together".  Why, cuz he was so cool.  I grew up at a time when Rock was so loud.  Rock owned the World & I was there to see it, so when Scott came alive on the scene, it was like, "Other Singers, who?"  He was so powerful.  I had never seen any singer like him & I grew up in Music.  He was born a drug addict, alcoholic & he suffered a mental illness & when you put that into a Rock n Roll lifestyle, that's why he was who he was.  It totally sucks.  It doesn't make sense & I feel so much pain for them so We should Remember Scott not this drama. I fkn love Scott & He's gone

Sex Type Thing https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hhu-OyHqZM

 

[Pingfah]

I totally get.  I may be part of the STP community, but I'm certainly not part of this side-bar community.  U need someone to blame, to put your anger on & it's easier to put it on a stranger who doesn't belong in your circle.  I'm not that girl. 

I'm not angry or upset with you, Scott, Mary or anybody else.  How you have gotten that from my telling you to stop making silly assumptions about people you don't know, I have no idea.

[JugeSTP]

(First time posting here, I've been lurking for years.)

Just decided to post because I'm reading people saying "oh, how come she isn't bipolar anymore?" "feels like a lie after the book", etc.


Honestly I never bothered w/her book, but I've been diagnosed bipolar 9 years ago. And this year, after MRI my neurologist just said I was misdiagnosed. "Oh, you have epilepsy, it's not the kind of seizures. Don't worry. At least you didn't lost much time of your life as bipolar and..."(this was before I told everything about my bipolar history)
I cried so much for days, because I didn't know if I was relieved or damn right confused, it gets to a point that you're the disease, the stigma, the insecurity of all coming back.

I know you guys probably don't want to read about a stranger, but it seems that any time bipolar subject came around this board when talking about Scott you guys were unsure about what it was like. In a way I'm glad most of you don't get it, 'cause at least it means you never been through it or witness someone really close to you being through this.

For me it all started with depression then stupor depression, to simplify and hurt less as I type, basically I was in bed waiting to die, doing literally nothing, not taking care of any needs, starving. After I got out of it with help of relatives and could walk again, I started doing therapy and I was sent to a neurologist by my shrink so I could be prescribed antidepressants. Not many improvement was seen and another doctor changed my medication and I started hallucinating and fell in psychosis. It all ended up with be committed to a mental institution in a straitjacket, being tied to my bed and being sedated. I spent a couple of months there. They diluted some medication so we wouldn't spit pills, it tasted terribly and I threw up and was then injected w/medication and started shaking and feeling really bad, almost overdosing until they gave me some antidote.


Anyways after this time in the m.institution I got diagnosed as bipolar by the doctor working there. I had a medication regime of many pills a day(at least 3 different medication mixed, one for mania/psychosis, one for dealing w/its side effects and another one for the side effects of the second one!). And this was the reason I always hoped Scott was saying the truth about being out illicit drugs, because any time I was going out of a manic episode and was being heavily medicated I'd be reduced to a zombie state, w/zero productivity, walking like an empty shell and even drooling. So I thought it could be side effects of his medication.(He mentioned takings med in Brett's interview and having trouble w/them)


And then after my medication was set to the minimum possible and I was again regaining my life, my thoughts, my sanity my psychiatrist(the same from the m. institution) would think it was not enough, that I was too slow, not lively as I should and would include an antidepressant. And anytime she did that, mania was back again. She kept adjusting the dose until I was a maniac again and trying different antidepressants. Never mind that anytime she's done that, all my progress, my life that was almost getting back to the tracks would be throw away in the most humiliating ways. And then heavy medication all again to end mania and then reduce it, then antidepressants. This cycle for 4 years.


Never mind that my life was ruined, that I was too embarrassed to want to see friends and even family again, after all I had done. I just want people to forget about me, the mess I was, I distanced myself from most people I could(and to this day I'm still quite distant of lot of people that still matter to me, cause I don't want to explain myself or make them feel sorry for me). But how come my doctor wanted me to look more livid if time after time I was accumulating misery, sadness...I had no proud or sense of dignity anymore. So I quit her.


I still had a medication regime w/another doctor, but then I decided to quit medication. After all that, it's only natural that would give up them. (Before I took all without questioning and where did it lead me?) Mania again. I found yet another doctor and this one changed my medication and although it was many pills at the start, as I was yet again regaining my sanity, he said to me that it was obvious I couldn't take antidepressants, that I was experiencing side effects that affected the minority of users. This was five years ago. I haven't had any mania episodes ever since.

I can say my life is for 5 years as stable as shitty lives can be. I mean, I'm thankful mania is gone but I still feel depressed and I suspect I may have some PSTD after the m. institution experience, I didn't get into detail here, but the things I've seen there...I was 16 at the time and as a minor my mother was able to be there w/me. To this day she says that that place is the closest thing to hell she can think about. And the times my life was starting again and being thrown to the ground, all progress lost...it really, it really hurts, it's like carrying an invisible burden of shame. I'm 100% sure if I was talking face to face w/you guys, I wouldn't say any of what I said here, it hurts so much, I think most of people don't want their own vulnerabilities exposed, especially the ones that will make you cry in front of strangers.

This year my neurologist, after I said what I said to you here and gave her my MRI exams, was like "oh no, this is really bad, really, really bad. You lost so much of your life" She wanted to know the name of the psychiatrist that prescribed the medication I still take everyday in minimum dose, 'cause she thinks he hit the nail perhaps by accident and by trying this medication that is primarily for epilepsy, secondly for schizophrenia and just more recently for bipolar disorder. So basically he tried something that was less usual for bipolar and it worked.

She said to me to never ever take antidepressants again, well I never would take those again even if I'm paid to anyway and to not even bother w/a psychiatrist anymore. "You don't need it" , she said. The thing is, I never had mania in my life before taking my second antidepressant.

I don't blame the doctor that messed up for 4 years w/me 'cause I know that the data was not there. In almost a decade lot of research was done and I've been following anything related ever since being diagnosed as bipolar years ago. The prescribing information of those medications have changed. All in all, it feels like I was a lab rat, but unfortunately I wasn't in a safe controlled environment.

So please, don't think that Mary saying she was misdiagnosed as bipolar is weird or that she's a liar. If you talked to me 6 months ago I'd say to you I was bipolar, hell, I could even write a whole book talking about what I've been through as a bipolar person and then find out I was not. I sought for a neurologist because of intense headaches, I wasn't expecting her to say that all my bipolar experience was medication induced and that I wasn't bipolar. And honestly, I don't know how the bipolar "tag" being removed makes things better after so much damaged was done. But perhaps I will start to believe more in myself and not think that I have a programmed sanity switch in the back of my mind that could turn anytime and ruin all I've built.



I was really heartbroken about what happened to Scott. I had no idea about it, then I turn on my phone and a friend messaged me. "Did Scott kill himself?" I was like in my head, "What? No, it can't be, it's a hoax, no...but if he's dead...I'll not cry, I'll be okay." Notifications about it and the news..."Okay, I'm okay. I won't cry." Then comes my mother to talk casually and I said to her, "Scott has died" "What, I can't hear it..." "Scott has died" "But how? What happened? Isn't it a hoax?" Then I just broke down crying, I could finish any sentences, I didn't want to read anymore, see anyone or answer my friend, I was angry w/her too, the worst way I could find out about his death, but how could she know I hadn't read the news anyway?

I only got to see STP once and it was the first gig I had the guts to join the crowd after my last mania episode. I was so damn nervous, insecure about going and the distress being in a crowd could cause me, but ultimately it was an amazing show and nothing bad happened. In a few days it'll be 5 years since that gig. 12/11/2010

Not my videos but I was there and almost 5 years ago I would never ever imagine we all would be grieving Scott so soon.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oyItWBcp7wQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhjUDn2QLt0

It was a small venue, but it's one that really has a big history over here. We were worried it wouldn't sold out, how could it not especially being the first time STP was in the city(after all if it don't sell no chance of coming back), but a week before it was sold out. To this day, I've never seem so many people trying to convince us in line for the gig to sell our tickets to them, people literally begging for tickets. It was no surprise that the next year STP was invited to play in a big festival in my country, but I couldn't travel to the city. Now, we could only guess what could've been of STP reunion. But this is what matters the last.


I did feel an accusing tone from Mary, kinda like Richard Patrick, pointing fingers to us, fans. But then again, what could we do? I used to tweet to Scott, but honestly I don't think he ever read those. Back in the Corpus Christi Vasoline Incident, I tweeted a long message(thanks to twitlonger) to support him, to say I knew how being bipolar was(before my new diagnose) but mostly to say music and even fans are important but fuck us, what matters is you, your family, being around those you love the most, don't give up. My opening line was begging to whoever run that account to forward to him, if ever reach him or not who knows. Would it make a difference? I don't know, but I feel guilty free of what Mary said.

About him being absent I feel for the kids 'cause I haven't seen my father in 21 years, he's married had kids but never bothered even telling me about them, found out thru my uncle, but my father and me is a completely different scenario and he lives in a different country. But he doesn't call or write.

Re-reading what I wrote about my "then bipolar" condition, kinda makes me feel that Scott may have distanced himself for similar reasons. Shame, guilty, you know, when you don't want to face someone's eyes even when you miss that person a lot? I never been addicted to anything, I can only imagine how his addiction made everything even worse and that the addiction in itself was caused by being bipolar. Destructive and even suicidal thoughts are really hard to overcome, worse yet, some medications even induce and increase these thoughts.


About the whole 60k thing, don't they adjust the payments if the person is making less? I don't get it.

So that his death isn't treated like many rock star deaths, with the same old tortured artist, soul too pure for this world narrative.

I agree completely, I think this is literally what I most read being said about Kurt by fans. And also the thing about sex, drugs & rock n' roll. Scott himself was too fascinated w/it, the insistence in "comparing" him to Bowie or Jagger, not everyone can endure the same things. And it isn't just him, it's worse, how many wannabe rock stars in the world get trapped within this mentality and die young before we could even know about them? I was once at a concert of a young band that is getting buzz here and even overseas and a girl in the audience, "boo! Look at that! they're drinking water! Water! Fuck you! If it was Eddie Vedder he'd be drinking at least wine! Fucking piece of shit!" I guess to her he's a fool just for trying to preserve his voice for the years to come.


 
And sorry for writing so many lines, but I felt as I had to. To think shame affected me and still affects me so much, imagine for Scott being in the public eye. These last years have been terrible for him and this year things got really bad. It's so debilitating and devastating, how many times have I cried because I could feel my spirit was dying? It's the feeling of nothingness, of being nothing, having nothing to give to anyone and that you can't fix anything anymore. That all is lost and there's no hope left.

Glad you finally joined and welcome to the forum! I wish it was under better circumstances. Thanks for sharing, I'm sure it's not easy but hopefully a little therapeutic to put that out there. Very glad for you that you found some answers and feel better now - stability is a thing we often take for granted but it's very hard to come by for some.