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Author Topic: A letter from Mary.  (Read 33130 times)

etcreative

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Re: A letter from Mary.
« Reply #165 on: December 09, 2015, 05:27:05 PM »
Slither you have no conscience.

etcreative

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Re: A letter from Mary.
« Reply #166 on: December 09, 2015, 05:27:43 PM »
      Thoughts.....

 Make no mistake Mary's letter is about more than her children, its about herself and $$$$.  After reading this I feel bad for Jamie and his kids mostly.  Lets remember Scott has a mother and father also....

 I believe she's telling the truth from her perspective about this.  Its believable.  It mirrors much of stuff we heard from members of STP and VR.  To a degree I respect her point of view as a mother.  Her kids have been abandoned and they are shattered.  But she has to act like a grown woman and assume greater ownership for her actions.

 Scott was a life long heavy drug addict and alcoholic.  They burn bridges and lie to support their addiction. And to make matters worst he's an artist....unfortunately if you read some credible biographies of these genius (actors, painters, musicians, writers, comedians etc.) you'll notice most of them are full blown narcissists.  They think they are better than you and me and nothing is more important to them than their 'art' and 'creativity'. 

 I can easily see him neglecting others to spend all of his time doing the things he loved (writing music, playing music, and doing drugs). 

 Today, I believe he never got clean.  He identified himself as a chronic relapser.  He would try and fail again. The circles these musicians travel in make it near impossible to get clean (old playmates and playgrounds).  I think his addiction systematically alienated him from anyone he would have to answer to.

 I also believe the heavy drug use caused brain damage.  I've watched tons of interviews and performances and there is evidence to support this.  He admitted to large parts of his life being totally lost in his memory. This would account for some of the things STP and she said.
 Okay get ready for real grown up talk.....You may not like it.....I don’t agree with her airing her personal family's dirty laundry with (rolling stone magazine of all places) the mass media after the guy dies.  In think its unhealthy for her family and a classless act.  These kind of issues should be handled by trained professionals behind closed doors.  These celebrities have no shame.  The narrative that the fans should feel guilty about enabling Scotts addiction is bullshit.

 Yes, his addiction destroyed his family and his relationship with his two children, but that’s not our fault. That’s his and hers.  Most of his fans are grown ass adults we can read between the lines and don’t need a full spread in RS magazine to shed light into the disease of addiction and the damage it does to families. 
 Mary takes little responsibility in her letter.  Now all the sudden she's not bi-polar?  Truth is if you read their biographies it sounds like they are both 'borderline personality'.  Similar pathologies attract each other.  And yes, she is an addict as well.....hope she hasn’t forget her 12 step program.

 She chose to live that lifestyle with that man and bear his children.  These are the consequences.  She suggests we (the fan's or society) should feel somehow culpable for Scott's self destruction and poor parenting?

 Ironically I bet if someone offered her a million dollars (tomorrow) for all the 'down and dirty' details about her children’s father she wouldn’t think twice about smearing the mans name....(oh that’s right she still uses his last name).

 I also think people (like her) underestimated how much this man was respected and loved for his talents.  I'm actually pleasantly surprised how much publicity and respect his work has received from the mass media since his passing.  Guys he was good and its deserving.  He had his major flaws - but he earned that.

 In the end its all politics.   Why feel the need to tell us he's an atheist?  After reading her 'letter' I feel a lot of the negative energy that us fans have felt on the outer edges of the network were generated from Scott's dysfunctional inner social circles.
 All of these people that have offered testimony on Scott (Dean, Mary, Matt, Slash, Richard Patrick etc) all happen to be addicts themselves.  When we read their 'finger pointing' we are experiencing their version of problem solving and family conflict. (victim, persecutor, rescuer -triangle) repeatedly.

 If no one cared about his death she wouldn’t feel so compelled to offer her point of view.  The opposite of love isn’t hate...its indifference....Mary clearly has unresolved feelings.  Scott hurt her and her children.

 60k a month is one hell of a child support payment.  I'm sure there was some major family conflict over that over the years.  Mary also seems a bit bitter towards him starting over with Jamie and her family.  I can understand why.

 I guess one would have to ask themselves, who gets most of the money from those ("depressing" 1967-2015 Scott Weiland) T-Shirts that sell?

 I feel horrible about this.  I feel nothing but sadness for Scott and his family.  I still cant bear to listen to anything of his music since his passing and I've listened to him almost every day of my life.  I grew up with him. As Scott's music evolved so did I. I didn't know him personally.  I've never met him.  He was a very flawed person I'm sure.  But I still love the guy....
 
 

etcreative

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Re: A letter from Mary.
« Reply #167 on: December 09, 2015, 05:31:05 PM »
Why do we have to know CPS was involved?

etcreative

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Re: A letter from Mary.
« Reply #168 on: December 09, 2015, 05:31:39 PM »
Why is it material for us to know hes an atheist?

etcreative

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Re: A letter from Mary.
« Reply #169 on: December 09, 2015, 05:32:06 PM »
Why refer to him at "that mess"?

etcreative

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Re: A letter from Mary.
« Reply #170 on: December 09, 2015, 05:33:56 PM »
Why reiterate (over and over) he forgot the words to his songs? BTW, this has happened to a lot of older performers who have large catalogues and past drug problems?

megafonemaniac

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Re: A letter from Mary.
« Reply #171 on: December 09, 2015, 05:36:05 PM »
After reading Mary's letter, I have now learned that being a parent and doing drugs isn't a good thing.
Which I never would have guessed??
So.....thanks???  ???

etcreative

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Re: A letter from Mary.
« Reply #172 on: December 09, 2015, 05:36:22 PM »
Why make repeated open references to his mental illnesses and call him "paranoid" multiple times in the letter?  Thats a pretty harsh reference for someone that just died.

Slither

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Re: A letter from Mary.
« Reply #173 on: December 09, 2015, 05:38:56 PM »
Slither you have no conscience.

You literally created an account here the day Scott died to demand a member be banned from the board, and I'm the one with no conscience?
When STP had a cookout after filming the video for the Core single "Plush," Weiland made jerk chicken that was "spectacular," Dean raves.

etcreative

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Re: A letter from Mary.
« Reply #174 on: December 09, 2015, 05:39:40 PM »
How would you feel if someone wrote those things about you or someone you loved after death?  If you try to provide some 'rational' answer to that question than you have little to no ability to walk a mile in someone else shoes. 


I keep going back to the obvious - it appears he has been interpreted as a mere cartoon character for some people.....that's what sad.

etcreative

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Re: A letter from Mary.
« Reply #175 on: December 09, 2015, 05:42:52 PM »
Why don't you answer my direct questions?  You're blind hatred for Scott has clouded your objectivity or any ability to be empathetic to him.  It's so obvious to me and everyone else. 


Why don't you address each of my 'logical' and 'rational' points?

DeadAndNotForSale

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Re: A letter from Mary.
« Reply #176 on: December 09, 2015, 05:45:48 PM »
People blatantly missing the point of the letter.

Second.
Denial. Denial everywhere.

Nothing new around these parts.

How is it that all you intelligent, eloquent people are missing the point of why Mary's letter is offensive to some of us on this board?? It's not denial, it's not that we don't agree what Mart is saying about not glorifying his death, it's not that we don't believe Scott was a shitty father. IT'S BECAUSE WE THINK MARY SHOULD NOT HAVE DIVULGED SUCH PERSONAL DETAILS ABOUT HIS SHITTINESS SO SOON AFTER HIS DEATH. She could have given the same message (however high and mighty I believe it to be) WITHOUT being so mocking and demeaning to her ex husband.


I guess it's just a matter of perception. While I agree it was a bit soon after Scott passed for her to speaking about Scott like this, it's hard to argue with her timing. With today's news cycle being what it is, who knows if people would have noticed or cared had she released this a month from now. She needed to talk about this while Scott's death was still big news. It's unfortunate it works this way, but that's the way it is.

I also don't agree that it was "mocking" or "demeaning". Her criticisms of Scott were delivered with sorrow and anguish, not ridicule. I'm sure there is MUCH worse shit she could have referenced to drive her point home, and I am sure it was tempting to do so, so simply mentioning things like having to sober him up before a talent show or listening to him cry over the phone didn't bother me.

She's in a tough spot, with a difficult message to get across at a difficult time, I think she did OK.

What I highlighted is the paradigm in this thread.  I and a lot of others didn't think she needed to do that at all.  We believe that she had no right to put some of those personal details out for the whole world to see.  I've mentioned this earlier in the thread, it's like an enraged spouse spouting off about her relationship problems on Facebook.  Except she put it on the biggest music website in the world.


Lovemachine97 hit the nail on the head earlier when he said that she did not go about getting her point across in the most effective way because she didn't highlight the good in him, which there certainly was.  There was so much negativity in her letter, that it comes off as someone who holds a grudge. 


Again you may see it differently and I respect your views, but it's fairly simple to see both sides of the fence in this "debate". 
« Last Edit: December 09, 2015, 05:48:07 PM by DeadAndNotForSale »
"I can sit there and feel a deep hatred for Dean and Robert, but when I hear them play guitar, I'm deeply moved." - Scott Weiland '94

Slither

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Re: A letter from Mary.
« Reply #177 on: December 09, 2015, 05:57:49 PM »
People blatantly missing the point of the letter.

Second.
Denial. Denial everywhere.

Nothing new around these parts.

How is it that all you intelligent, eloquent people are missing the point of why Mary's letter is offensive to some of us on this board?? It's not denial, it's not that we don't agree what Mart is saying about not glorifying his death, it's not that we don't believe Scott was a shitty father. IT'S BECAUSE WE THINK MARY SHOULD NOT HAVE DIVULGED SUCH PERSONAL DETAILS ABOUT HIS SHITTINESS SO SOON AFTER HIS DEATH. She could have given the same message (however high and mighty I believe it to be) WITHOUT being so mocking and demeaning to her ex husband.


I guess it's just a matter of perception. While I agree it was a bit soon after Scott passed for her to speaking about Scott like this, it's hard to argue with her timing. With today's news cycle being what it is, who knows if people would have noticed or cared had she released this a month from now. She needed to talk about this while Scott's death was still big news. It's unfortunate it works this way, but that's the way it is.

I also don't agree that it was "mocking" or "demeaning". Her criticisms of Scott were delivered with sorrow and anguish, not ridicule. I'm sure there is MUCH worse shit she could have referenced to drive her point home, and I am sure it was tempting to do so, so simply mentioning things like having to sober him up before a talent show or listening to him cry over the phone didn't bother me.

She's in a tough spot, with a difficult message to get across at a difficult time, I think she did OK.

What I highlighted is the paradigm in this thread.  I and a lot of others didn't think she needed to do that at all.  We believe that she had no right to put some of those personal details out for the whole world to see.  I've mentioned this earlier in the thread, it's like an enraged spouse spouting off about her relationship problems on Facebook.  Except she put it on the biggest music website in the world.


Lovemachine97 hit the nail on the head earlier when he said that she did not go about getting her point across in the most effective way because she didn't highlight the good in him, which there certainly was.  There was so much negativity in her letter, that it comes off as someone who holds a grudge. 


Again you may see it differently and I respect your views, but it's fairly simply to see both sides of the fence in this "debate". 

I do see both sides, I even said it's a matter of perception. I just understand the utility in releasing the statement when she did, even though it was a bit harsh. I also do not agree with the "enraged spouse on facebook" comparison because this actually has purpose.

Anyway, I feel like I just keep arguing in circles and I don't want to make this board any more toxic in the wake of Scott's passing than it already is. Speaking of which...

Why don't you answer my direct questions?   You're blind hatred for Scott has clouded your objectivity or any ability to be empathetic to him.

Because your questions are not worth a response. Saying I have blind hatred for Scott proves you do not understand me at all. My 1,000+ posts here, A STONE TEMPLE PILOTS FAN FORUM, while probably a bit depressing should tell you how impassioned I feel about him and the rest of the band. I'm sad just like everyone else, but as I mentioned earlier, I understand Mary's motive and believe the jarring timeliness of her message is worth the number of lives it could potentially change.
When STP had a cookout after filming the video for the Core single "Plush," Weiland made jerk chicken that was "spectacular," Dean raves.

Aylin

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Re: A letter from Mary.
« Reply #178 on: December 09, 2015, 05:59:53 PM »
People blatantly missing the point of the letter.

Second.
Denial. Denial everywhere.

Nothing new around these parts.

How is it that all you intelligent, eloquent people are missing the point of why Mary's letter is offensive to some of us on this board?? It's not denial, it's not that we don't agree what Mart is saying about not glorifying his death, it's not that we don't believe Scott was a shitty father. IT'S BECAUSE WE THINK MARY SHOULD NOT HAVE DIVULGED SUCH PERSONAL DETAILS ABOUT HIS SHITTINESS SO SOON AFTER HIS DEATH. She could have given the same message (however high and mighty I believe it to be) WITHOUT being so mocking and demeaning to her ex husband.


I guess it's just a matter of perception. While I agree it was a bit soon after Scott passed for her to speaking about Scott like this, it's hard to argue with her timing. With today's news cycle being what it is, who knows if people would have noticed or cared had she released this a month from now. She needed to talk about this while Scott's death was still big news. It's unfortunate it works this way, but that's the way it is.

I also don't agree that it was "mocking" or "demeaning". Her criticisms of Scott were delivered with sorrow and anguish, not ridicule. I'm sure there is MUCH worse shit she could have referenced to drive her point home, and I am sure it was tempting to do so, so simply mentioning things like having to sober him up before a talent show or listening to him cry over the phone didn't bother me.

She's in a tough spot, with a difficult message to get across at a difficult time, I think she did OK.

You're right about the timing being important from the publicity/exposure front.  I don't think it is the correct time to be preaching this at all (she sounds too pompous), but if she must get her message across, I guess this is the right time to do it.

The 'demeaning' parts I found to be comments like 'someone propping him up on stage', 'having to calm him down in his paranoid crying' (how must Jamie feel reading that, that her husband was calling Mary to help him - she wants to look like the saviour, the only one who could help him. It's disrespecful to Jamie and to Scott), or the fact that he wouldn't come to plays because 'now he's an atheist' - as if saying this is his flavor of the month, he's petty and shallow to become an atheist because of his new wife.  There are ways she could have gor her message across without being so mean.

This is not a tell-all, stripped-down exposé that she is writing about her ex (if she wants to do that and spill all the beans, she has a right to. But at least people then know what to expect in that and have a right not to buy it). But it's not an exposé piece, or an exert from her new book. It's a fucking statement on the passing of the father of her children and should have been more respectful.

 If you play Devils advocate and read the letter from a bitter, opportunistic, jealous ex wife view point, you'll see it is littered with mockery and passive aggression.
« Last Edit: December 09, 2015, 06:05:02 PM by Aylin »
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Flyingmerpa

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Re: A letter from Mary.
« Reply #179 on: December 09, 2015, 06:02:58 PM »
.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2021, 08:32:25 PM by Flyingmerpa »